The dreaded new guy problems...... 4th of July S+

[Blythe1566]

Ok I have searched high and low trying to avoid asking repeat questions....

I bought a 2cm 4th of July machine (11/94 build), it was inop when purchased for $200 from a local guy.  Got it home, put a new battery on the 10mhz board, cleared my 61 loop and got it semi-running.  My coin situation is sketchy lol. It has a IC 33 comparator however I can find zero available harness to plug it in and someone has bent the rake out of the way.  The optics pick up coins with about 40% success, honestly the coin slot seems too large for its 25 cent denom.  It has a dbv 200 bill acceptor but the nose is missing and I will have to repair the four wire harness to the right of acceptor before I know its status.  Those things are not top of my list  

I have come to realize the game play is totally wrong.  This is a type 5 machine, it's supposed to nudge and respin.  Well it doesn't nudge at all and respin is not at all on the correct symbol.  So I wanted to check my proms, of course they are not labeled so I went thru option 4 as described and the numbers it gives are not ordinary.  Winner paid displays 3373 and then a 2 aligned to the right,  credits stays a 0779.  I tried removing and reseating the proms but no change. 

What proms should I order to start diagnosing this problem or is it a board issue etc?  Btw during payable testing the reels are also quite incorrect along with its pays.  I feel like someone shoved random proms into it at some point...  help

[rokgpsman]

Welcome to NLG!   

Don't worry about being a new guy with slot machine problems - you and others like you are a big part what the NLG website is for!

SP779 is a Type 2 and Type 21 SP chip (Haywire games), the 4th of July needs a Type 5 SP chip. So something is wrong here. It is the SP chip that gives the 4th of July game its "nudge" feature.

The SS3373 on your mpu board does not match up with a 4th of July machine from what I can tell, unless I'm missing something. Did you mean SS3733 by any chance? That would be a Haywire SS chip, and SP779 is also for a Haywire game. Maybe someone replaced the mpu board or the 2 chips from another machine, that would account for the mismatch with the SS and SP chips.

The glass on a 4th of July 2 coin S+ should look something like this:

http://www.newlifegames.net/igtbible/IGT%202CM/Game%20Library%20-%20S-Plus%20-%204th%20Of%20July%20(2%20Coin%20Multiplier).htm

And you can see the SS chips in the chart that are for the 4th of July 2 coin game. You can order any of the SS chips in the chart, depending on what payback percentage you want.

If you can post a few photos of the machine, showing the entire front, and of the reels with the door open that will help us to see better what you have.

[rokgpsman]

If your machine's glass and reel strips are for a 4th of July machine then all you need to do is replace the SP and SS chips with the correct ones.

If the coin comparitor isn't working that's why someone bent the rake, so that an inserted coin will drop thru it and then onto the coin optic boards and get a credit. You can get the correct wiring harness for the coin comparitor, and replace the comparitor if needed. The typical cc for an S+ is a CC-16D model, should have gray wires for the rake solenoid, I think that indicates the cc is a 24 volts ac model. Not sure if the comparitor in your machine is also the correct model.

The machine may have originally been setup for half-dollar or dollar coins, that's why the coin head slot is too big. That will also explain why some inserted quarters don't give a credit. In between the coin optic boards is a coin spacer, if it is for a large coin then when the quarter drops thru it will sometimes miss the optic sensors. You can remove the coin optic boards and see what size coin spacer is in there. If you have trouble getting the correct size spacer some people just put a piece of non-conductive foam or other material in there.

Be aware, if the machine was setup for larger coins at one time then the hopper may also be for larger coins. So if you intend to use quarters you may need to replace some parts on the hopper. Photos of the hopper coin wheel will tell us about that.

[Blythe1566]

I tried to post pics but the ones I have are too large currently lol.  Haywire would make sense because what I am assuming is a respin does act more like a haywire lol.   Yes it has correct reels and glass looks just like the pic from the bible for 4th of july, how do I know what chip to purchase?  I can see from the chart to order a SS4171 etc but what type 5 SP chip should I get?  The MPU board metal cover has 4th of july written in the dip switch settings chart but someone could have swapped the whole board over at some point too.  This would explain the lack of nudge and mismatching etc.

[rokgpsman]

For 4th of July the SP chip can be any Type 5 SP chip. The newer ones (higher SP number) will have more features. I would contact someone like NLG member RB about getting the correct SS and SP chips, he will recommend the right ones. Pick any SS chip in the chart for a 4th of July 2 coin machine.

Here is a list of many of the SP chips:
http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?topic=303.msg847#msg847

Some SP chips are only for a 16mhz mpu, so avoid those. You want one that will work on a 10mhz mpu since that is what you have.

The photos have to be 1meg or less in size. If you can't find a way to reduce them you can send them to me and I will post them for you. My contact info is over to the left of this post.

If you check the settings or options on your camera or phone many have a way to reduce the size of the photo it takes.

Or you can get photo edit software and reduce your photo. It is available online for free download at various places. If you plan to do a lot of photo uploading to forums it might be good to learn how to reduce the photo size.

Or you can email the photo to yourself and post that reduced version here. Emailing the photo will often automatically reduce it, so the email you receive will have a smaller version of the photo.

As a last resort you can post your photos at a free photo hosting site like imgur.com, imgbb.com or others. Then add the link to the photo in your message here. But if that site goes down or changes things then your photo will no longer be viewable here so this isn't the preferred way to get a photo posted. For longevity it's better if the photo is posted directly to NLG but sometimes that isn't possible.

[Blythe1566]

Awesome, thanks so much for your help, I just ordered some chips that should get the machine spinning and paying correct and then I can fix the coin and dollars .  It does have a working 25 cent hopper so that's a plus lol.  I bet your correct, it at one time was a dollar machine with the jumbo slot and optics issues.  I went ahead and ordered Clear and Set chips in case I need them in future to get bill validator running etc. 

Out of curiosity, I see people selling New old stock IGT glass, reels, software and looks like sound card etc as a package deal on ebay.  For instance, everything needed to convert to like 10x Pay etc.  If I had a 16MHZ mpu could these kits be utilized to re-brand the game?

[rokgpsman]

Yes, to do a game change you would change the reel strips, the glass artwork on front of machine and the SS chip on the mpu. But if the game you are changing to requires a different SP chip then you'd need to change it also. No need to change the mpu board just to convert the machine to a different game, unless you have to use an SP chip for the new game that is a 16mhz chip. There are a lot of SP chips for many different game Types, hopefully you could get an SP chip that works in the 10mhz mpu that you already have. Some people report that the 16mhz boards have more noise in the sound. But if the game change kits include a 16mhz mpu and the price for the kit is good then that might be a good way to do it. Make sure the kit is for an S+ and not an S2000.

[rickhunter]

Yes, you can rebrand your machine with any S+ compatible kit.  You don't need a 16mhz mpu, you can play any S+ game with a 10mhz one (most of us prefer the 10mhz one, as the 16mhz has annoying background hissing sound due to poor design).  The only difference is faster credits rollup and the sounds are a bit difference (the dings), but it must have not been better because the current IGT avp rollup sounds are like the older 10mhz one.  Just make sure the award glass matches your cabinet, otherwise you are going to be hunting down a different top box to match your glass.

[jay]

Just qualifying my esteemed colleagues comments

There are 3 kinds of S+ - all are functionally the same but the top box glass is different.

16" Glass (tall cabinet, maximized artwork)
Round Top - These are usually the most desirable due to the shape and there were even some made with hard woods.
9"  Chop top - shorter cabinet smaller glass on the top.

Belly Glass, while themed is the same size across the spectrum.

Reel Glass is usually Black, Blue or Red. Pretty generic. There are exceptions for themes like Royal Flush - while not an exciting game there are 4 variations which make the entire machine look like a card.
Some of the 5 line and 9 line games have unique glass that show the 5 or 9 lines on the reel glass.

I own two 9" and a 16" and I have 60 game kits - and I have collected both the 16" and 9" glass so I can play any theme on any machine.


 

[shortrackskater]

Just qualifying my esteemed colleagues comments
There are 3 kinds of S+ - all are functionally the same but the top box glass is different.

What about those monster slant tops?   

[knagl]

If I had a 16MHZ mpu could these kits be utilized to re-brand the game?

You don't need or want a 16MHz MPU board.  Your 10MHz board can support nearly any S+ game kit that you'd want to put in.


For your coin issue, you likely have a $1 or large coin "encoder" in your coin-in optics (it's a piece of plastic that helps to align the coin as it goes past the optics).  You'll need a $0.25 encoder to resolve the issue of the machine eating quarters and not giving credit.

[Blythe1566]

Thanks guys for all your help, I am still awaiting my correct ss and sp chips in the mail so I can get the reels matching pays. I've been looking for the stuff to change my slot size to .25 so far I've only found nickle size.

[rokgpsman]

Even if the coin head (chrome part where you insert the coin) is too big the quarter will probably still drop into the coin comparitor ok. But you need to put the proper sized spacer in between the coin optic boards so the quarter will move past the coin optic sensors reliably. Otherwise some quarters won't be "seen" and the machine won't give you a credit. IGT made plastic spacers for this but you can put something non-conductive in there (like a piece of foam) until you find the actual spacer part. Contact one of the slot parts people like Jim at Midwest Slots (or others on the NLG home page) to get this spacer. He may also have the quarter coin heads too.

Below is a photo of the coin optic spacer. Notice the deflector near the middle of the spacer, that's what causes the coin to drop thru the coin optic boards in the correct position. This spacer is for a nickel, they made them for different size coins and the deflector will be in different place depending on the size of the coin.

Have you looked at the hopper to see if it is setup for large coins?