New replacement S2000 power supply available?

[Sunrise Side]

Is there a new power supply board replacement for these S2000 power supplies? Just the board. Changing caps does not always work and some of the other components on the board that are defective are obsolete. Thanks!! Tim

[Trisail]

Hey Tim,

I've looked for some kind of drop in - with the power good signal - I have not found anything reasonably priced, in my opinion. I'm sure when no old ones are around the price won't matter any more.

2 ideas I have thought about and looked into are - 2 PS's to replace the 13V 12A/24V 8A ones. ( about 350 watts ) The other idea would be to use two 12 V 30A/25A/15A >=350 total watt supplies and wire them for 12 V and 24V to get the current output. (12V power supplies are widely available, not so much for 24V) Both of these ideas would require an added small device to be used for the 5V power good signal the machine requires. ( unless of course one supply had the signal built in - I'm just not seeing anything like that yet. )

Cost today for just the supplies - approximately >

12V 15A and 24V 8A = $40 to $50

2 12V 30A = $35 to $45

Would also need to add the Molex connector so the unit would plug into the machine.

Would the replacement PS's fit in the existing power supply housing, I believe they would.

Maybe others have come across something or have ideas on how to tackle a replacement.

[Sunrise Side]

Used units are around $30 - $50. Used units most likely have 7-10 years of casino use at 24/7.  My guess these used units  won't have much life left in them and that is what I am experiencing now. PS dieing  often. I just keep throwing in used PS and that is only a bandaid !  So $100 to $125 for a new unit that will end this weak spot in a S2000 would not be a costly  repair.   I didn't look at the manufacturers of these PS to see if anyone of them still has them available or are these IGT rights only design? I believe there is 3 or 4 manufactures of these power supplies? Which brings up another question? Why would there be that many companies making these PS ?  Or was this design used elsewhere? Besides gaming equipment?

[Trisail]

I figure the cap replacement should bring them back for another 3 to 5 years. I don't have any history on that but the main components should be good even after the years in the casino. There are a few discrete components that go bad too, zeners and resistors mostly from what I have seen on the supplies I have worked on, maybe not the S2000 ones but the WMS ones for sure.

I am not seeing any of the supplies from any of the manufacturers at all, too old I can assume. The case and connector would not be something that would be around these days new.

I will assume the reason for multiple manufacturers for that supply would have been for the need to have many on hand when the machines were built and for repairs. I see some references/descriptions on the web as amusement/arcade use but I couldn't say what other machines would have used them. I would think most were built for IGT slot machines.

I think for going new - putting together a retro-fit would be the way to go. I would try to put that in the original case and use the connector.

The caps and then re-soldering of the Molex connector pins (cold joints there and possibly other places) seems to me to get them working pretty good. Can't say how long for sure. Bandaid issue - I guess it depends on how many you go through.  A new replacement would probably be good for 5 years + ( actually probably longer as they most likely are not on 24x7 in home use, but then again turning electronic devices on and off - I digress)

Some day when I get caught up with all the stuff and projects I have on my plate       I can tackle a retro-fit.

[Iamwally]

I use HP server power supplies in my holiday lighting hobby.  They are available on eBay usually around $8-$10 each if you buy them in a lot of 8-10.  They are rated at 12v 62.5a would those work for this use case?  Just a thought!😊

Thanks,

John

[Trisail]

The 12V server supplies are good. Just like the LED supplies. Lots of the 12V ones out there.

I'm sure they wouldn't fit in the original enclosure. Keeping them in there would reduce the cost and time. Most of the ones I've looked at probably won't fit real well anyway.

I prefer inexpensive 'fixes' and don't worry too much about the time I spend on things. I figure if something/someone came up with a decent option it would be a DIY thing.

If not in the enclosure, maybe just using the mounting bracket would work.

I'm sure someone will come up with something reasonable before I get the time to put something together. More than one way to approach things.

I'm rethinking how two 12V supplies can be used to do the 24V and still use one for the 12V. Not sure it's as simple as it sounded. Probably need to go with 12V single and 24V single. $50 for both not that bad I suppose. Three 12V may be better, cost wise.

Anyway, later.

[Sunrise Side]

Tony. Yes a retro fit would be Great!. As long as it fit the bracket . Doesn't have to be enclosed.  These S2000 are still in the Tribal  casino today near me. They have a lot of them. I wonder what they are doing for replacements? These machines are over 20 years old and they are still running a ton of them.

[dailey]

I wonder if you're under estimating the life of these power supplies. If you take a used power supply and re-cap it, I'll bet you can get 10 to 20 years out of it in home use. I have 6 S2000 machines and haven't yet had a main supply go bad. I have an extra one that I re-capped for backup but so far have never needed it.

My opinion is that a power supply running 24-7 in a casino environment will have a shorter life than in home use because temperature (time @ temp) shortens the life of electrolytic capacitors. I'd like to hear from others on their experiences.

[Trisail]

I agree, replacing the capacitors should bring the supply back and good for a few years. How many, who knows. When they were built I'm sure they were not meant to last 20 years, kind of like all the Y2K stuff back when, too many old computers still working past there intended life span, what a mess, but it got worked out. Same goes for power supplies. Most of the discrete components were built to last, many years if not virtually forever. The aluminum electrolytic capacitors (AEC) have a finite lifetime. They have a lifetime rating associated with them from the manufacturer, usually - 2 to 5 years. I work for a semiconductor company and repair the parts that go into all the machines that make the chips. Most of the machines were built in the 90's to early 2000's. The power supplies are still working, 24 x 7 operation, the machines themselves are still putting product out. Electronics can and will work for many years if things stay nominal. It's when a failure occurs and what steps are taken to repair that can cause many problems.

Power supplies are usually either linear or Switch Mode (switching). Linear supplies were used before switchers came out. They were big and not very efficient, switchers on the other hand are smaller and much more efficient - 80 to 95%+. Almost all the supplies in the slot machines are switching supplies. The AEC's are used to filter AC noise out of the DC voltages and for timing of the Pulse Width Modulator chips/circuits (PWM). The cap that is very important in a switching supply is the one that sets the timing up for the PWM, changing just that one cap, many times, can get a PS working. The reason most don't change just the one - all the AEC are the same age and probably need to be replaced anyway. When the timing gets off over time as the cap degrades (time @ temp) the power supply may still operate, but the ripple and timing can cause the other devices to heat up and degrade. AC ripple on DC voltage is bad. AC ripple (noise) can look like valid signals to MPU/CPU timing signals, data, address, all the 5V logic the MPU/CPU needs to run the machine. When machines start acting strange or have intermittent problems - power supplies, power and ground signals need to be checked, especially if the symptoms seem to be unrelated or look like a common point of failure. I'll stop here on this.

When I repair the supplies I get, I usually check the caps just see what they look like and give me an idea if I think the supply might work after the cap replacement. Say a supply has 10 AECs in it - 3 may read absolutely nothing, 3 may read out of tolerance by a lot, 3 may read a bit high but in tolerance, 1 may even read OK. The big AC input caps are usually OK, even read OK, plus the cost of replacement is high compared to the other smaller ones. I have only had to replace these caps on maybe 2 PS's because they read nothing or 'rattled'. The DC output filter caps should be replaced, they keep the AC ripple (noise) out of the machine devices and the MPU. The PWM cap - replace it, that circuit needs to be pretty darn close to design to work correct. SMPS's are very involved to design and build. They work at fairly high frequencies (K's), that is how the AC is converted to DC, and the pulse width timing is used to control the current as it fluctuates when the machine is operating. They are pretty amazing and why they can be smaller and have higher current output capabilities.

So I guess I've rambled enough for now.

A reasonable retro fit would be in order and I would like to get something working. I would like to get a reasonable drop in replacement for the video poker CRT's too someday. Even get to working on my Arduino stuff again and about 100 other nice things. I need to get the many items I am behind on for the members I am helping - I'm sure they would appreciate that 

Hope to get to everything and keep helping where I can. I'm still working 40+ hours and REALLY thinking about retiring from my job - but - I enjoy the work I do, the pay and benefits are good, the rest of it ... well ....

[Stayouttadabunker]

Tony...Love reading your "rambles"! Awesome stuff! 

[Trisail]

Thanks. Nice to know at least one person is OK with my information overload!   

Mostly hope it might help others now and in the future.  I am a guy that figures more information is better. I've heard to a point though 

[Sunrise Side]

Who sells recapped S2000 power supplies?

[dailey]

One source of good reconditioned power supplies, though expensive, is SuzoHapp.

[dailey]

Tony,

I enjoyed your information also and don't consider it rambling. It's good to hear from an Electronic Technician. My electronic experience is much more narrow in scope. I'm sure you know what a trimpot is. I worked for the company that invented the trimmer, Bourns Inc.  Currently retired.

[Trisail]

Very good. Yep trimpots and Bourns, very familiar.